SPEAKER_03: 0:03

Welcome to Hormone Heroes, where I share testimonials from real people who have experienced bioidentical hormone therapy. Men and women share the symptoms they have experienced and the difference proper hormone replacement has made. I'm your host, Dr. Kelly Hopkins, and I have been in the functional medicine space for over 30 years, with a focus on hormones for 20 years. Please keep in mind this podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Please consult with your physician or practitioner for medical advice. Let's get started with today's guest. Hello and welcome to the podcast. Today I'm very excited to have my friends Josh Barnes and April Slagger. They are both massage therapists and the owners of New You Rejuvenation Spawn Massage in Hot Springs, Arkansas. So welcome, Josh and April.

SPEAKER_00: 1:01

Hey, thank you for having us.

SPEAKER_03: 1:03

Today we're highlighting you guys because, first of all, you are both stellar human beings, but you are also competitors in the fitness world and you pay attention to your bodies. And I encourage everyone that's listening on audio to go to YouTube and look at these two beautiful people. But fitness is crime in your life, and you have to stay fit to do your jobs as massage therapists and owners of the spa. So let's start with you, Josh. You're from Arkansas originally, correct?

SPEAKER_00: 1:36

I am, yeah. Uh was born in Mina.

SPEAKER_03: 1:38

Born in Mina, Arkansas, which is famous for the American Maid movie.

SPEAKER_00: 1:44

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_03: 1:45

Yeah, you did not know that.

SPEAKER_00: 1:46

Yeah, I think you're right, yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 1:48

They were flying in cocaine into the Mina Ark uh Remember?

SPEAKER_00: 1:53

I think was uh started.

SPEAKER_03: 1:54

Yeah, I love that movie. But Josh, tell us how you met April and just take it from there as far as give us kind of a background of your life.

SPEAKER_00: 2:03

Yeah, so um essentially I started going to massage school, and it was essentially at a point in my life where I had done it when I was younger, and then I joined the military, and through all that it expired, and so to be able to massage again, I had simply had to go through it. Luckily, the VA paid for it this time, so that was really fantastic. And while I was going there, April, she was going through massage school as well, and it was yeah, it's pretty awesome. She was just just really laid back and pretty cool to talk to, and you know, I personally uh don't typically uh hadn't dating in forever and really wasn't even a thing that I even thought about. And so we just had a lot of similar interests, like a lot of similar interests, especially with fitness, and and it just kind of went on from there after the science school. We just continued to talk and you know ended up together as a couple. Um so it worked out a little bit.

SPEAKER_02: 2:58

Lucky guy.

SPEAKER_00: 3:00

Well, and I've told her before it, you know, and another thing too, this it's kind of funny because a lot of this is because of hormone treatments. Because we happened to meet a point in my life where I was just now getting right, because before then, like I was a mess for hormone treatment. I mean, just an absolute mess. And it just so happened that she met me when I was going through hormone treatment. Thank goodness. Yeah. No, and so I was feeling regular, and then I was, you know, then I felt confident and like, you know, maybe I could add something to a relationship and not, you know, uh bring a bunch of baggage. And yeah, it was pretty amazing um how it kind of worked out.

SPEAKER_03: 3:42

Yeah, and uh just knowing you, Josh, I know that you were struggling with some depression and just maybe stress situations in your life.

SPEAKER_00: 3:52

Uh yeah, for a long time. I um, you know, I probably since uh probably noticed maybe around when I was 30, 28, 30, definitely after my last deployment, I got back and you know, I knew something's off, but you know, like most, I just assumed that, okay, well, you know, I can fix it, right? You just gotta be mentally tough. That's all it is, you know. Right. Therapy. And but eventually things weren't really panning out. The little tricks, little mental things that I picked up from therapists, they just they weren't working anymore. And then essentially it all came down to um I was living at my brother at my time or living with my brother at the time, and everyone had come over for it was what was it like uh 4th of July, right? But I had no idea. So everyone comes over, and uh at that time I was just kind of a hermit. I would just go to my bedroom and kind of sequester myself in there. And so but you know, I tried to make uh be part of the family, so I I I went down there and but I I could only be down there a couple minutes because it was just so exhausting. I'd go back up, recover. Well, one of the times I was down there, one of my nephews they'd run by and you know, just kids being kids and then not something off the table. And I just lost it, you know. I was just yeah, I was yelling and it was just it was terrible. And I knew at that point that I I couldn't continue. Like it it was just something was broken. Uh-huh. And so I um well, I thought then that suicide was is the best answer. And so I prepped for it and I I got everything ready and I collected, you know, medication, you know, through the VA, and I was like, okay, you know, and and I was like, all right, we're gonna do this. And it was kind of a relief, I'm not gonna lie. It felt comforting. To know you had a plan. Yeah, you know, I was like, all right, you know, no more having to plan and having to go and worry about the future. And so um, it just so happened though, before that happened, I was talking to my stepdad, he had mentioned passing by that there was a TRT clinic that had opened up. I was like, oh, okay. Uh this is probably 2018, probably, and uh so I went and you know, just just out of curiosity, see what my testosterone was, and lo and behold, I had the testosterone of like uh like a 80-year-old man, apparently. Wow, and it was it was such a relief because here I thought that I was broken and there was nothing I could do. I was just that was it. It was the end of end of the line for me. And so I started getting shots, and then like magic, you know, like and I try to explain people, it's not that treatment gets rid of everything that's going on, like the issues that we have, but what it does do is it helps you to finally deal with it and process stuff. Whereas before everything just felt all consuming, like you were just drowning. Yeah, you know, every day was just uh you were just treading water essentially. And I would tell people the effort it took to get out of bed when you're in that place when your hormones are off that bad and depression is it's the same effort it takes for some to drive to the gym and work out.

SPEAKER_03: 6:55

Right, right. How old are you, Josh, now?

SPEAKER_00: 6:58

Now I'm 46.

SPEAKER_03: 7:00

So when you started treatment, you were 30 40 or I think I was 30 something.

SPEAKER_00: 7:07

38.

SPEAKER_03: 7:07

Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 7:08

And I had gone so long just thinking that was just normal, you know.

SPEAKER_03: 7:13

So you think you possibly could have needed testosterone back in early 30s or absolutely because I didn't film like this for probably early 30s.

SPEAKER_02: 7:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 7:23

You know, I think me and you have talked about it before, and I've talked about with other physicians that like I think what happens is any kind of stressful job over a long amount of time, essentially it in that constant fight or flight, you know, it causes adrenal burnout, I guess. And so your body simply can't keep up with that. Just like with anybody, say someone that does NDMA or whatever, like you know, it it basically your body just can't produce that enough to keep you going. Because I have listen, I have so many friends that have committed suicide in the military, and I think it was their hormones, you know, and it's just but you don't know what you don't know, right? It's a shame a lot of physicians nowadays they don't they want to prescribe and push, you know, antidepressants and all that instead of just well, what does your hormones look like?

SPEAKER_01: 8:12

Yeah, without doing any blood work, without doing any research.

SPEAKER_03: 8:16

Yes, it's it's a band-aid approach for sure. So thank you for your service, Josh. And I think this will speak very much to people that have been in the military, but even just men in general that are burning the candle at both ends, and as their testosterone depletes, because it a normal healthy male, he loses one to three percent of his testosterone every year past age 35 or so. So you add that on top of stress, and the adrenals are supposed to be our backup system to our hormones, and when both of those are depleted, you really are just hitting bottom. Tell me your treatment regimen now.

SPEAKER_00: 8:57

You microdose testosterone shot, sipinate or yes, just uh siponate, but also as you know, we started doing pellets for quite a while, and then of course kind of ran into a situation where it was hard to get the pellets in me.

SPEAKER_03: 9:13

Yes, because you're so lean.

SPEAKER_00: 9:15

Let's ask that but yeah, and uh like I said, pellets though worked really well, they were fantastic. Uh what I noticed the difference between pellets and injections is that pellets simply feel more natural. You know, I feel that there's an even kill, whereas unfortunately testosterone, the way it's normal prescribed, is usually one shot once a week, which unfortunately, because of the half-life, it spikes and then it starts to you know degrade, which can lead to a spike in estrogen and then a drop. So yeah, I think pellets for the most part are probably the best way to go about it for sure.

SPEAKER_03: 9:51

Yeah, it does give you an even dose for four to six months, especially if you're a male, but you do have to have some body fat and it's hard to find any on Zosh in April breath.

SPEAKER_00: 10:04

But pellets are very practical too, in a sense that you know, especially if you're a job where you have to travel, yeah, and you know, stuff like that. It's just yeah, it's very advantageous.

SPEAKER_03: 10:14

So do you microdose?

SPEAKER_00: 10:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_03: 10:17

Is that how you handle yours? Okay. Yeah, yeah. Do you inject two or three times a week?

SPEAKER_00: 10:22

Yes, I usually uh break it up usually three days a week.

SPEAKER_03: 10:25

Do you do IM or sub Q?

SPEAKER_00: 10:28

Uh intramuscular.

SPEAKER_03: 10:29

Okay. So you don't mind sticking yourself?

SPEAKER_00: 10:32

Oh, absolutely not. But I will tell any more listeners out there that, you know, when I first started, I was using like most like 23, 24 gauge needles. And you know, you obviously want to rotate because of scar tissue, and it's and a lot of times I have to psych myself up, you know. Yeah. But then I found out that it's much easier if you draw with an 18 gauge and then you can use an insulin needle just to bat fill. Yeah. And then you know, and if you're lean enough, you know, it's not a problem, you know, like using a half-inch insulin needle.

SPEAKER_03: 11:00

So yeah, yeah. So other than helping you with depression, what else did the testosterone do for you?

SPEAKER_00: 11:08

You know, you know, even if it was just for the depression, that alone was worth anything. Because essentially, it if it wasn't for that, yeah, I would I I wouldn't be here today. Absolutely be here. And so that alone was just incredible. But my gosh, the benefits are just, you know, like you have now the ability, and I'll tell you, before I even came to that decision, I had been working out for probably four or five months because I know and mentally for me, my mental health was very associated, obviously, I think, with most people with their health. And so I thought, well, maybe if I just get in shape, I'll feel better. Well, I worked for out three, four months and there was no change taking place. I'm like, what? And I'd always experience change. Well, uh-huh. But when you get your hormones right, and well, for one, when they're not right, you can eat all the right things, you can work out as hard as you want, but you're just it's a hamster wheel.

SPEAKER_02: 12:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 12:01

But once I got that testosterone, everything was right again. Oh my gosh, it was like when I was 20 again. You know, like just the drive to want to deal with the mental drive, and then the physical change, it was quite literally like magic. True.

SPEAKER_03: 12:15

Wow, that's so awesome. And you guys are such a successful couple, and I know that change in you led to you guys getting together and owning your own business and doing all it makes you want to stride and and and reach goals where before goals were they were like this boogeyman.

SPEAKER_00: 12:35

Yeah, I was always you know hiding from.

SPEAKER_03: 12:38

Yeah. Okay, Miss April. You as well are born and raised in Arkansas.

SPEAKER_01: 12:45

Yeah, born and raised here. I left about 18 years old to kind of discover the world a little bit, and then I came back to Hot Springs seven years ago, and it just kind of started again with my path to health and wellness and massage and aesthetics, and then met Josh, and it was with him that you know we always liked working out together and doing stuff, but I could always see other girls in the gym or influencers, which I know I shouldn't base my expectations off influencers, but I would see them and I would think, why can't I get there? Like, what is holding me back? Like it got so quite my hormones were so off balance that I would finish my workouts and then just be bottomed out for the rest of the day. Like I couldn't function at all. It was just tiresome.

SPEAKER_02: 13:41

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 13:42

And um, Josh kind of suggested he's like, Whoa, hormone therapy worked for me. Maybe you should at least check it out and see what your numbers are. And surely I went came in to see you, and you were like, Yeah, you're you need help. Uh-huh. And you got me right. And you know, it's been how long have we been doing like doing pellets on me? Like at least four years.

SPEAKER_03: 14:07

At least I was thinking closer to five.

SPEAKER_01: 14:09

Maybe six, but maybe it may be, yeah, yeah, yeah. It might be five at least five years. And I'll say probably within the first six months that I was on pellets, I hired a fitness coach. I competed in a bodybuilding show. Yes, and then went on to do another year of competitive bodybuilding. I mean, I exceeded anything that I ever thought that I could achieve. Like it was unreal the difference.

SPEAKER_03: 14:35

So you really you already had the discipline of eating properly and working out, but the hormones really that absolutely. I remember you, I believe you were estrogen dominant, and we just needed to balance you at the time with testosterone and progesterone. And what's great for everyone that's listening that is into fitness and things, females do not have to have a male dose of testosterone to get so lean. We gave you a female dose, which when girls are young and healthy, they make 10 times more testosterone than estrogen. Guys always make a hundred times more. So it's not like we were responsible for really muscling you up, it just gave you the extra push you needed to get the body fat off. And I I've asked April what she did to get oh, gosh, you're you're just so beautiful and so lean. And now you've gone into you're into cycling now, and that's kind of your main focus.

SPEAKER_01: 15:45

Yeah, competitive bodybuilding was great and it taught me a lot of things, but it's not a place to live for me personally. I love riding my bike. I love being able to have the option to do other workouts besides just weightlifting. And so cycling to me is the best thing in the world. I could do it all day, every day. Yes, so much.

SPEAKER_03: 16:06

And it's been fun to watch your body change. You know, when you were doing the body building, you were very muscular all over, and I know I'm not using the exact terminology, but then to watch as you site you've been cycling now a couple of years, and your your legs are so defined and amazing, amazing. And Josh, didn't you say you hate to ride with her?

SPEAKER_01: 16:31

Because she's a monster, a beast. I'm getting there, I'm getting there. So are you competing? No, but this year with cycling, I wanted to take it a little bit more serious. I wanted to see what my numbers could really produce. So we got power meters on the bike yesterday. And so I'm gonna start really focusing on like my power output. With that, we'll see how much I change this year. That's incredible. Yeah, we're excited. I love watching you.

SPEAKER_03: 17:02

Well, tell us a little bit about your business. New you, rejuvenation, spawn massage. Tell us about it.

SPEAKER_01: 17:10

Well, what we do is uh we cater to a lot of tourists, but we also have a handful of our locals that we love to work on as well. So for mostly our tourists, we do massage facial, your basic spa treatments, give them a chance to kind of relax, tailor their treatments to what they need. And then for our locals, we offer a lot of athletic services, we offer a lot of targeted massages. I've gotten a couple of clients that have cycling injuries, and because I can translate how I feel, I'm able to continue treatment for them the proper way. So, you know, working on local athletes is probably one of our favorite things to do.

SPEAKER_03: 17:56

Yeah. And I do have to say you're located on the beautiful Lake Hamilton, and the view from the windows in your spa are out over the lake, and it's just gorgeous. Yeah, it's a lot of fun. It's a great destination. So facials massage, a lot of focus massage, any other specialty treatments or anything?

SPEAKER_01: 18:20

Little body treatment things, um, mask, body mask, body scrubs, things like that, basic foot treatments. We don't have any nail techs on board, so we don't do anything like clipping the nails, the cube, yeah, thing like that, but just basic foot treatments.

SPEAKER_03: 18:36

That sounds great. April, how old are you?

SPEAKER_01: 18:39

I'm gonna be 50 in May.

SPEAKER_03: 18:41

And you just look amazing.

SPEAKER_00: 18:44

At least she makes me feel very insecure.

SPEAKER_03: 18:49

Josh. You're so handsome too, Josh. So moving forward, what's the next five years look like for you guys?

SPEAKER_01: 18:58

Well, we are looking to grow the business. One of the things that Josh and I are gonna do coming up in about five weeks is we're gonna take an ashiy class. Wow. So we want to start offering couples ashiyatsu and um giving kind of our tendons and our joints a break. Yes, yeah. So we're looking to kind of go into that avenue as well. I've had it done before, it's lovely. We have a couple of therapists that are skilled in it, they absolutely love it. So that's what we want to do over the next five years and just continue to grow and get better and better every day.

SPEAKER_03: 19:42

Yeah, yeah. Well, that's awesome. Thank you so much for being a part of this today. And you guys are hormone heroes. If anyone sees you around town or at the gym, at the spa, they all know that it's obvious that you take care of yourselves. You're the like perfect human specimens. And I'm just glad hormone treatment's been a part of it for you guys.

SPEAKER_00: 20:05

Yeah. Me too.

SPEAKER_03: 20:07

Is there anything you'd like to say to our listeners before we go today?

SPEAKER_01: 20:12

Yeah, I mean, I feel like anyone from 30 to 40 should start at least getting their blood work done and just creating a base as to where you are so that for future reference, you have kind of something to go off of if you do choose to go down the hormone route. I can't say enough good things about hormone replacement. I really can't. It's not something that I'm ever going to be without.

SPEAKER_00: 20:41

And I would have to say that um, kind of like what she spoke about, which is yeah, get a snapshot. That way, if you feel good now, that way when you if you ever do need treatment, that you know exactly what your body looks like as far as levels that would make you feel good. But the last thing would be that just remember that you shouldn't be ashamed if you need treatment, because when I asked her to go to that TRT clinic, I can't tell you the amount of people that would come in hoodies, they would park on one side of the parking lot and sneak in. It's like you don't need to be ashamed about it. You're not, it's not your fault, you're not broken, right? It's okay.

SPEAKER_03: 21:18

It's yeah, men especially might feel like, oh, I'm not masculine enough. I if I need help with testosterone or something. And with all the tools, it's just another tool to make you the monster man you you want to be, you know, inside and out. So, well, thank you so much, and I'll let you get on with your day. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for listening to Hormone Heroes. Take a moment to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts so you don't miss the next episode. While you are there, help us spread the word by leaving. A rating and a review. If you would like to share your bioidentical hormone story or need help finding a physician in your area, please email us at dr Kelly at hormoneheroes.org. That's D-R-K-E-L-L-Y at H O R M O N E H E R O E S dot org. We want you to be a hormone hero.